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Moving battery into cab...


 
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BearMatthews
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Joined: 13 Jun 2010
Posts: 110
Location: Devon, UK

PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 14:53    Post subject: Moving battery into cab... Reply with quote

I want to fit a bigger, gutsier battery to my vit for the winch, lights, etc...
I want to put in the cab behind the driver seat...

So what do i need to do it? What guage cables?

And earth straight to chassis or back to engine body?? + a light earth cable to the body?

Or possibly have two batteries? :S

Any help appreciated Smile
Cheers, Christian.
_________________
Vitara JLX 1.6
3" suspension lift
2"Body Lift
External Roll Cage/Tubular cab and rear end
32" Dumper Tyres on 10" deep dish 8 spoke wheels
Welded (Locked) Rear Diff
Winches front an rear
Rad In Rear
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hucky
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Joined: 18 Feb 2010
Posts: 17
Location: manchester

PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 15:48    Post subject: Reply with quote

following information has been quoted from www.marcleleisure.co.uk which is pritty useful.




have coloured the main cable red which is most likely the same as your vehicle, however the other vehicle cables will be a variety of colours. The terminal numbers above are the standard numbers found on automotive relays. Terminals 85 & 86 are the coil, which activates the relay. Terminals 30 & 87 are the switch contact terminals.

Basically, all you need to do is identify the cable which runs from the alternator to the warning light on the dash board. Rather than pull your dash to bits, it may be easier to have a look at the cables on the back of the alternator. You'll find one or two large cables which will be the cables which run back to the battery. You will also find one smaller cable which is the charge indicator cable (no doubt someone will come up with some exceptions)

Now you've identified the charge light cable, its a simple mater of connecting it to the one side of the coil on a 12 volt relay (assuming your vehicle is 12 volts), the other side of the coil is then connected to an earth point (which eventually goes back to the negative terminal on the battery).

I have drawn the above with 30 amp fuses in line with the battery link cable (do make sure the cable between the vehicle and auxiliary battery is capable of handling 30 amps, otherwise you can quite easily create a fire hazard). This size is normally sufficient, however if you have a really dead flat second battery they may blow. Don't increase the fuse size unless your cable and relay are rated for higher currents.

The above is reasonably reliable, however some alternators don't like additional loads being applied to its charge indicator circuit, in which case the alternator not only fails to charge, but also fails to activate the split charge relay. In this situation a voltage sensing relay could be used.
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BearMatthews
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Joined: 13 Jun 2010
Posts: 110
Location: Devon, UK

PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 18:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thankyou for that!
That is a handy diagram but for my purpose i think i will just move it and put a bigger single battery in...

Can you help me with that wiring?

The chunky positive needs to go back to the terminal on the alternator, i know that. Is it then okay to take the positive feeds for this lights etc from that terminal rather than running them all back to the new batt location? I assume this will be fine as long the cable will cope with the amps?

But my main question is, does the negative strap need to go to the engine body or can it go strait to the chassis near the new battery location? I will have a lighter guage strap going from the negative terminal on the battery to the body to ensure the body has a good earth.

Also do you think 4AWG cable will be ok?  What kind of amps does a standard suzuki starter draw?

Cheers,
Christian.
_________________
Vitara JLX 1.6
3" suspension lift
2"Body Lift
External Roll Cage/Tubular cab and rear end
32" Dumper Tyres on 10" deep dish 8 spoke wheels
Welded (Locked) Rear Diff
Winches front an rear
Rad In Rear
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zocko
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 1438
Location: Southampton

PostPosted: Tue Jul 06, 2010 22:41    Post subject: Reply with quote

the starter will pull sbout 550-600 amps on a cold day....

and the cable goes to the starter
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BearMatthews
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Joined: 13 Jun 2010
Posts: 110
Location: Devon, UK

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:10    Post subject: Reply with quote

That much :O
I know the positive goes to the starter but what about the negative?
Can i have the negative go strait to the the chassis or does it need to go back to the battery as standard?
Bear.
_________________
Vitara JLX 1.6
3" suspension lift
2"Body Lift
External Roll Cage/Tubular cab and rear end
32" Dumper Tyres on 10" deep dish 8 spoke wheels
Welded (Locked) Rear Diff
Winches front an rear
Rad In Rear
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zocko
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Joined: 13 Sep 2009
Posts: 1438
Location: Southampton

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 18:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

everything earths to the chassis/body so there only needs to be a heavy cable from the chassis/body to the battery negative
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the car in front is a toyota...

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me and the wife
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Joined: 07 Aug 2007
Posts: 1013
Location: gosport

PostPosted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 19:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

zocko wrote:
everything earths to the chassis/body so there only needs to be a heavy cable from the chassis/body to the battery negative


what he says Very Happy
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pearsorm
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Joined: 20 Jun 2010
Posts: 21
Location: Lakenheath, United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

My advice to you is that you should leave the standard battery alone and add a second battery of the same size under the bonnet. You can then link the batteries via a 100 amp (or larger) split charge relay or diode pack. and wire it with cable that is at a minimum of 16mm2  (224/0.30mm) starter cabling which is rated for 110 amp. Note you will find that this cable will actually exceed what is currently installed stock on your Vitara. You can have the split charge relay wired to any ignition feed so that the batteries will only be connected with the ignition switch on. You can add a second emergency start switch feed from the second battery to allow you to bypass the main battery if you find your self in a situation that the main battery is flat. This will allow you to jump start your own vehicle with out opening the bonnet. Then you can run your accessories from the second battery this will help to prevent you from depleting the main battery. This is the setup that I have in my vitara. I have made my own battery tray and used terminal blocks to allow for the safe removal of either battery. I have used a new skoda fleicia battery as my second battery because I had it on hand. It is only slightly larger in size then the stock battery. Note to remember automotive fuses only provide catastrophic failure protection not overload protection. Automotive fuses are deigned to stop curretn flow when it exceeds 2x rated value. For example a 30 amp fuse will open the circuit when current flow reaches approximately 60 amps. I have chosen not to use a fuse in the main battery feed from the main battery as I have used cabling exceed the manufacturers cable sizes and have protected the cable from end to end with flexible conduit rated to 600VAC and supported through out its length. to prevent any possibility of chaffing. I have chosen this route as the short circuit possiblities have been minimized and I do not wish to have a fuse to stop me from being able to start the vehicle in an emergency. By the way this is the same basic setup used on rapid response fire service vehicles but obviously scaled down from 24volts to 12 volts and cable sizes reduced as well. As you are aware suzuki have not  protected the starter feed for similiar reasons. I can provide photos if required but any modification you perform on your vehicle is done at your own risk.
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